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rarsneezesdeltarune chapter 2 no mercy / "snowgrave" route thoughts because im going fucking thru it
(spoilers obviously for both it and some ch1 stuff and some undertale no mercy route stuff)
like okay. i think. obviously undertale no mercy route is some creepypasta shit, right? how specific you have to be, to even activate the route, you know. going out of your way until the "BUT NOBODY CAME" happens. and like the dialogue gets fuckt a bit because something's clearly Wrong about the human and all the monsters can fucking see it when they interact with you, you know?
and the way it's an active choice, the way sans calls you out, the way chara wrests control from you at the end and takes over, robbing you of any say so as the final moments play out
but the way undertale's no mercy is framed is like. you are obviously teaching a kid (chara) that murder is fine actually and yes the world is horrible and we SHOULD end it! and thats fuckeed up. and your role in that is fucked up, and i think the meta level of sans calling you out for getting this far just to SEE WHAT HAPPENS... (i think flowey does too? that or flowey calls out the people too cowardly to do it themselves and watch someone else do it) is unreal. it's some next level shit.
and like it is DEFINTELY horrifying, really, but like
deltarune chapter 2's no mercy route, idk if people are calling it snowgrave route? i saw one person use that. anyway. god. that's hitting me in the like... place that only the gaster stuff in undertale ever hit me. the terrifying, under the surface, creepypasta stuff.
and maybe it's just because we have 2 out of 7 chapters so it's impossible to know how chapter 2's choices will play out on the rest of the game that makes it so terrifying, but like
it's going to sound weird and we definitely do not have enough of deltarune to like. for me to 100% sell you on this. because it's not a whole game. BUT. undertale's no mercy route feels like a game you are playing, a game gone wrong, and the game has consequences-- but the consequences are also fake? which i think might just be the whole "we do not know how these consequences will affect the rest of deltarune yet, because the rest of deltarune doesn't exist" but even STILL
there's the fact that ch2's no mercy route is... nothing you are making kris do. it is something you are making NOELLE do. and something about that is just hitting different to me. something about not controlling the "PC" (WHICH DELTARUNE PACIFIST IS ALREADY GIVING YOU A LOT OF WEIRD FEELINGS ABOUT) but having the "PC" *influence the party member* is... god it just hits differnet i think.
and the game gives you so many places to back out. like so many. the fucking document on this reads like a creepypasta by itself, and how the actual literal game plays out doesn't stop that feeling at all. but you really do have to like. be so so so so SO specific about doing this, and you REALLY REALLY REALLY have to bully noelle, in a way that you... obviously don't have to bully frisk+chara (or, even kris, for that matter). at every fucking point deltarune is making it absolutely clear that this will have consequences, and you are like. genuinely horrible for carrying on with it.
also god THE FACT BERDLY DIES? HOW THE HELL IS NOELLE GONNA COPE WITH THAT
it probably is because its unfinished so there's ltierally no way of knowing how this will go but it sincerely has hit so much harder than undertale's no mercy route did for me lol.... i love chara so much but nothing about them even a bit tops how much deltarune frames you, the player, as an actively harmful role in kris' and everyone else's lives lol.
like even pacifist route is bad enough because its hard to say kris like... is enjoying being meat-puppeted around
and i'm really really really thinking about like. the way that deltarune is framed - once again ch2 gives you so many chances to back out - is that like not only are you actively making a terrible choice (as in UT no mercy) but the game really frames you, the person calling the shots, as fucking evil. and if you want to keep going you have to keep playing the part.
like, the idea that this is happening because some malevolent entity is making it happen...already good horror potential. but the fact that the malevolent entity is framed explicitly as YOU, THE PLAYER. just. this is a layer that's horrifying frankly!!!!!!!
AND I REALIZE I SUPPOSE THIS IS NOTHING UNDERTALE SHIED AWAY FROM, TRULY,
BUT I CANNOT STRESS ENOUGH HOW MANY CHANCES NOELLE FIGHTS BACK LIKE ARE YOU *SURE* ABOUT THIS, AND HOW MUCH YOU ACTIVELY HAVE TO BULLY HER INTO IT. THERE'S SO MANY CHANCES TO ABORT--INTENTIONALLY OR ACCIDENTALLY--SO YOU HAVE TO. NOT ONLY DO YOU HAVE TO CONTINUE CHOSING TO BE EVIL, BUT YOU HAVE TO KNOW HOW TO EFFECTIVELY BE EVIL. IT'S SO INTENTIONAL. SO PREPLANNED. YOU, THE ENTITY CALLING THE SHOTS IN THIS HORRIBLE SHOW, HAVE TO KNOW WHAT TO DO, AND IF YOU DON'T KNOW HOW TO MAKE THINGS GO WRONG, YOU WILL EITHER NEVER TRIGGER IT OR YOU WILL NEVER SEE IT THROUGH TO THE END BECAUSE
SOME OF THE OPTIONS TO MAKE SURE YOU STAY ON ROUTE? SO INNOCUOUS. SO EASY TO CHOOSE WRONG OPTION IF YOU DID NOT KNOW WHAT THE RIGHT ONE WAS. THE LEVEL OF INTENT BAKED INTO THIS IS UNREAL
AND GOD! NOELLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! her thinking this is a dream... how is she going to cope tomorrow when it's clear berdly is Fucking Dead, like. she's already having enough misgivings-- NEVERMIND YOU CAN TELL HER OUTRIGHT THAT IT WAS NOT A DREAM-- how is that going to feel. killing one of your best friends, in what you thought was a dream, but it was real. and he's dead. and its your fault.
nevermind the fact that people are obviously aware something is Fucking Wrong with kris.... god i cannot stop thiking about ralsei trying to shift player attention to susie and noelle and - without any input from you, btw, this is past the point of no return, you cannot view that conversation with susie and noelle - the fact that he can't. and he's worried. he's like hm. i suppose i'll have to try later.
and then he doesn't.
ralsei knowing about the player and actively shifting our attention away from kris-- that on its own is already some incredible implications and i want to see how they play out, but! man!!!!
snowgrave route probably feels so shitty because of how you have ruined noelle's life and everyone thinks its fine but like it's not, really, it's really not... and you know that... and you know that its your fault....
and god my brain is BUZZING with what the fuck an aborted snowgrave route looks like. once again tehre are easily ten places to abort this route. what happens then. what happens to the dialogue. what happens in the middle ground?
we don't know! can't wait for the fandom to scrape this for content and dialogue - god knows i'm not strong enough to do it myself.
and its fascinating and wonderful so how such a cheeky little game that on the surface is light hearted as hell has such such SUCH a dark underside if you just push for it - WHICH GRANTED. I GUESS IS THE CONSEQUENCES OF A WORLD WHERE YOU ARE CANONICALLY MAKING THE PC A MEAT PUPPET AND REFUSING TO LET THEM MAKE CHOICES FOR THEMSELF!!!!!! DELTARUNE PACIFIST DOES NOT SHY AWAY FROM THE SKETCHY IMPLICATIONS OF THIS!!! OF COURSE NO MERCY LEANS ALL TEH WAY INTO HOW FUCKED UP IT IS!!!!!!!!
god. to think last night my thoughts were just heehee queen favorite UT/DR character of all time and tonight i'm just sitting here horrified AND KNOWING I'M GOING TO BE THINKING ABOUT DELTARUNE MUCH LONGER THAN I INTENDED TO BE. because. Because. snowgrave route is frankly horrifying
creepypasta shit but you're the ghost haunting the cartridge and it is very very real, at least to the characters
god help me
(spoilers obviously for both it and some ch1 stuff and some undertale no mercy route stuff)
like okay. i think. obviously undertale no mercy route is some creepypasta shit, right? how specific you have to be, to even activate the route, you know. going out of your way until the "BUT NOBODY CAME" happens. and like the dialogue gets fuckt a bit because something's clearly Wrong about the human and all the monsters can fucking see it when they interact with you, you know?
and the way it's an active choice, the way sans calls you out, the way chara wrests control from you at the end and takes over, robbing you of any say so as the final moments play out
but the way undertale's no mercy is framed is like. you are obviously teaching a kid (chara) that murder is fine actually and yes the world is horrible and we SHOULD end it! and thats fuckeed up. and your role in that is fucked up, and i think the meta level of sans calling you out for getting this far just to SEE WHAT HAPPENS... (i think flowey does too? that or flowey calls out the people too cowardly to do it themselves and watch someone else do it) is unreal. it's some next level shit.
and like it is DEFINTELY horrifying, really, but like
deltarune chapter 2's no mercy route, idk if people are calling it snowgrave route? i saw one person use that. anyway. god. that's hitting me in the like... place that only the gaster stuff in undertale ever hit me. the terrifying, under the surface, creepypasta stuff.
and maybe it's just because we have 2 out of 7 chapters so it's impossible to know how chapter 2's choices will play out on the rest of the game that makes it so terrifying, but like
it's going to sound weird and we definitely do not have enough of deltarune to like. for me to 100% sell you on this. because it's not a whole game. BUT. undertale's no mercy route feels like a game you are playing, a game gone wrong, and the game has consequences-- but the consequences are also fake? which i think might just be the whole "we do not know how these consequences will affect the rest of deltarune yet, because the rest of deltarune doesn't exist" but even STILL
there's the fact that ch2's no mercy route is... nothing you are making kris do. it is something you are making NOELLE do. and something about that is just hitting different to me. something about not controlling the "PC" (WHICH DELTARUNE PACIFIST IS ALREADY GIVING YOU A LOT OF WEIRD FEELINGS ABOUT) but having the "PC" *influence the party member* is... god it just hits differnet i think.
and the game gives you so many places to back out. like so many. the fucking document on this reads like a creepypasta by itself, and how the actual literal game plays out doesn't stop that feeling at all. but you really do have to like. be so so so so SO specific about doing this, and you REALLY REALLY REALLY have to bully noelle, in a way that you... obviously don't have to bully frisk+chara (or, even kris, for that matter). at every fucking point deltarune is making it absolutely clear that this will have consequences, and you are like. genuinely horrible for carrying on with it.
also god THE FACT BERDLY DIES? HOW THE HELL IS NOELLE GONNA COPE WITH THAT
it probably is because its unfinished so there's ltierally no way of knowing how this will go but it sincerely has hit so much harder than undertale's no mercy route did for me lol.... i love chara so much but nothing about them even a bit tops how much deltarune frames you, the player, as an actively harmful role in kris' and everyone else's lives lol.
like even pacifist route is bad enough because its hard to say kris like... is enjoying being meat-puppeted around
and i'm really really really thinking about like. the way that deltarune is framed - once again ch2 gives you so many chances to back out - is that like not only are you actively making a terrible choice (as in UT no mercy) but the game really frames you, the person calling the shots, as fucking evil. and if you want to keep going you have to keep playing the part.
like, the idea that this is happening because some malevolent entity is making it happen...already good horror potential. but the fact that the malevolent entity is framed explicitly as YOU, THE PLAYER. just. this is a layer that's horrifying frankly!!!!!!!
AND I REALIZE I SUPPOSE THIS IS NOTHING UNDERTALE SHIED AWAY FROM, TRULY,
BUT I CANNOT STRESS ENOUGH HOW MANY CHANCES NOELLE FIGHTS BACK LIKE ARE YOU *SURE* ABOUT THIS, AND HOW MUCH YOU ACTIVELY HAVE TO BULLY HER INTO IT. THERE'S SO MANY CHANCES TO ABORT--INTENTIONALLY OR ACCIDENTALLY--SO YOU HAVE TO. NOT ONLY DO YOU HAVE TO CONTINUE CHOSING TO BE EVIL, BUT YOU HAVE TO KNOW HOW TO EFFECTIVELY BE EVIL. IT'S SO INTENTIONAL. SO PREPLANNED. YOU, THE ENTITY CALLING THE SHOTS IN THIS HORRIBLE SHOW, HAVE TO KNOW WHAT TO DO, AND IF YOU DON'T KNOW HOW TO MAKE THINGS GO WRONG, YOU WILL EITHER NEVER TRIGGER IT OR YOU WILL NEVER SEE IT THROUGH TO THE END BECAUSE
SOME OF THE OPTIONS TO MAKE SURE YOU STAY ON ROUTE? SO INNOCUOUS. SO EASY TO CHOOSE WRONG OPTION IF YOU DID NOT KNOW WHAT THE RIGHT ONE WAS. THE LEVEL OF INTENT BAKED INTO THIS IS UNREAL
AND GOD! NOELLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! her thinking this is a dream... how is she going to cope tomorrow when it's clear berdly is Fucking Dead, like. she's already having enough misgivings-- NEVERMIND YOU CAN TELL HER OUTRIGHT THAT IT WAS NOT A DREAM-- how is that going to feel. killing one of your best friends, in what you thought was a dream, but it was real. and he's dead. and its your fault.
nevermind the fact that people are obviously aware something is Fucking Wrong with kris.... god i cannot stop thiking about ralsei trying to shift player attention to susie and noelle and - without any input from you, btw, this is past the point of no return, you cannot view that conversation with susie and noelle - the fact that he can't. and he's worried. he's like hm. i suppose i'll have to try later.
and then he doesn't.
ralsei knowing about the player and actively shifting our attention away from kris-- that on its own is already some incredible implications and i want to see how they play out, but! man!!!!
snowgrave route probably feels so shitty because of how you have ruined noelle's life and everyone thinks its fine but like it's not, really, it's really not... and you know that... and you know that its your fault....
and god my brain is BUZZING with what the fuck an aborted snowgrave route looks like. once again tehre are easily ten places to abort this route. what happens then. what happens to the dialogue. what happens in the middle ground?
we don't know! can't wait for the fandom to scrape this for content and dialogue - god knows i'm not strong enough to do it myself.
and its fascinating and wonderful so how such a cheeky little game that on the surface is light hearted as hell has such such SUCH a dark underside if you just push for it - WHICH GRANTED. I GUESS IS THE CONSEQUENCES OF A WORLD WHERE YOU ARE CANONICALLY MAKING THE PC A MEAT PUPPET AND REFUSING TO LET THEM MAKE CHOICES FOR THEMSELF!!!!!! DELTARUNE PACIFIST DOES NOT SHY AWAY FROM THE SKETCHY IMPLICATIONS OF THIS!!! OF COURSE NO MERCY LEANS ALL TEH WAY INTO HOW FUCKED UP IT IS!!!!!!!!
god. to think last night my thoughts were just heehee queen favorite UT/DR character of all time and tonight i'm just sitting here horrified AND KNOWING I'M GOING TO BE THINKING ABOUT DELTARUNE MUCH LONGER THAN I INTENDED TO BE. because. Because. snowgrave route is frankly horrifying
creepypasta shit but you're the ghost haunting the cartridge and it is very very real, at least to the characters
god help me
